Posts by Jan Schockaert

Hi guys!

Today I had a good session on the Hybrid 91 Airinside and did some fin testing. It seems that t36 who told us he used a 48 cm fin was on the right track in spite of the rule of thumb that says a 58 cm would be a better fit for the Hybrid 91. Today I started with a 58 cm Boss fin. It's a formula fin type B6 72 S that I rebased to 58 cm for the Hybrid 91 Airinside. I was on my North Warp 9.6m sail from 2013 which feels really nice on this board.

With the 58 cm fin thr tail of the board had to much lift and the mast needed to be far in front to make the set sailable. Wind picked up and it got difficult to keep control. The board never felt loose and fast in spite of the lift from the fin that was too high.

Then I Switched to a 50 cm F4 fin. It's a 54 cm with 4 cm tip cut with good power and control.

With this fin I could put the mast base much further to the back and after changing mast position several times I found a real good setting that makes the board getting on the plane very easily and let it run loose.

Conclusion for now is that the 58 cm fin was really way to long/powerful and the 50 cm fin was the best until now. I'm gonna try 47 cm Carpenter and 48 cm Z-fins the next time to see whether those give enough lift.

The board surprised me in the way that it doesn't need a long fin like a formula board while being shaped more like a formula board than a slalom board.

OFO of my 85 wide slalom board is 57 cm.

OFO of my formula board is 87 cm (Patrik fotmula 180 Airinside)

OFO of the hybrid 91 Airinside is 77 cm so much closer to formula than to the slalom board but still the required fin length is much smaller.

Hi Simen,

I only had a few sessions with the Hybrid 91 and still testing different fins. Until now the Kashy 64 cm felt best but I guess it will be better with a 58 cm fin. I bought a Hurricane formula fin that I will rebase to 58 cm. I hope that will work nicely. I'll post my findings here

I have a whole series of Airinside boards. I started with buying a Formula 180 Airinside after trying windfoiling that I did not like as much as normal windsurfing on the fin. I bought the Airinside version because I wanted a board that would last longer. Before that Formula board I had a Patrik Formula V3 with full core. The difference between the full core and the Airinside was really stunning. The weight is about one kilogram lighter but the feeling is entirely different. The Airinside board is much more vivid and feels smaller than it is.

I also had a Patrik slalom 140 full core with which I was very happy in terms of performance. I used it a while and kept an eye out for the same board in Airinside version and I found it after a while. So I bought the second Airinside board, a slalom 140 Airinside V2. I bought it from a German competition windsurfer who was changing sponsors after using the board for 4 years! He told me he had a hard time letting it go because he's convinced it is the best board in its size. He changed to Duotone and after about 6 months he contacted me to ask whether he could buy the board back from me because he love it so much. I had gallon in love with it in the meantime so I kept the board and use it very often. Last Monday I was still on it for about 80 km.

After the slalom 140 I bought a slalom 115 Airinside and recently I bought a Hybrid 91 Airinside that I tested Monday and it is really nice too.

Like you say the Airinside boards feel very agile, stiff and vivid. I sometimes try a board from a friend to check whether the settings are alright and it always feels like the full core boards are heavy and sluggish but I think you get used to it very quickly if you wouldn't have an Airinside anymore.

There is certainly not a big difference in performance because otherwise we would see those boards everywhere winning races and that's not the case. But I do like the feeling of an Airinside board more than a full core board and there are others that are better surfers than me who think so too...

I just looked up the mails I exchanged with Jack Carpenter in 2022 and I see that first I asked him whether I could rebase 45 to 42 and he said yes. That made me reply whether I could rebase 45 to 33 and he replied yes, it's all the same.

Since then I already cut some longer fins and have following Carpenter fins with all the same feeling, so no difference between original or rebased:

- 36 cm = 38 rebased to 36

- 37 cm = original 37

- 38 cm = original

- 40 cm = 47 rebased to 40

- 42 cm = 45 rebased to 42

- 42 tip cut 2 cm ( has power/lift of around about a 43 and I use it as 43) = 47 tip cut 2 cm rebased to 42 tip cut 2 cm

- 44 cm = original 44

- 46 cm = original 46

- 47 cm = original 47 = my backup fin in case I want another size I can rebase it to the length I need

To the fin builder Jack himself. He told me he cannot follow the demand of the fins so he limits every order to max 3 fins. I had to wait more than 6 months if I wanted to order one to max three fins. On the second hand market I found the bigger sizes like 46 and 47 cm fins regularly and at a decent price and so I asked whether it was an idea to rebase those long fins to a smaller size to get my Carpenter fins earlier and then he told me all the fins have the exact same layup so you can rebase to the size you want and you get the same fin as an original Carpenter in that same size

I had a first running on this board yesterday. I started the session on my Patrik slalom 140 Airinside with 8.4m Duotone Warp. When the wind dropped a little I just put the 8.4m on the Hybrid 91 with a 64 cm Kashy sXs formula fin.

I thought the fin might be too long but I didn't have any other fin In the range of about 58 cm which should work according to the rule of thumb of OFO x 0.75 so I just tried it.

The combination was pretty ok. Maybe the fin is a little too long but not so far from ideal. I did about 20 km on this setup with gusty wind. In the luls I could keep the board planing, in the hard gusts, I was afraid of the aggressive acceleration but the control was ok. I could go really fast for a board this size with only 8.4m sail

After the session I went to pick up the formula fin that was rebased from 70 to 58 cm. So next time I will be able to try that fin. But for now I'm already happy with the performance of this board. It goes through lulls like nothing else and is fast. Pointing is really nice too.

That's good to know. I won't set my expectations too high then.

But still I'm convinced a 48 cm fin is too small for this board. A wider OFO asks for more lift and That's why this rule of thumb of fin size = OFO x 0,75 works well with as good as all single fin boards. So I will try it and I will let you know.

I asked Patrik Diethelm which fin type I would need for my Formula 180 Airinside and he said he didn't know because the board was mainly used for foiling. So I tried the fins I had and bought some others until the feeling was right (and the GPS speeds were ok).

Hi t36,

I understand your reply about the advantage of the foil but I tried foiling and to me it's something entirely different. The feeling is entirely different and I like windsurfing on the fin much more. Even if I need bigger sail sizes to get going.

I have a Patrik Formula 180 Airinside too and use it with 11 and 12m sails. In those conditions I don't even see a lot of foilers because they can't fly unless they use big sails like 9 or 9.5m. On our homespot we see a lot of windfoilers but in really light wind the wing foilers are the first to fly it seems.

There is a simple rule of thumb that says the right fin size for a board is the width at OFO x 0,75. In this case the OFO is 77 cm so the right fin size would be around about 58 cm. This is for a sail size that is ideal for the board and that is dividing the board width in cm by 10 and than you get the ideal sail size in square meters. You can add or subtract 1m surface so sails of 8 to 10 square meters would be ideal following these rules of thumb.

This is only a startPoint because you just have to try fins, sails and setup like footstrap positions and see what works well. That's a really fun proces too!

Thanks for the reaction! I can believe the foil setup was earlier to get going than the 48 cm fin with 8.4m sail. I plan to use 9 and 10m sails with this board. 48 cm seems small for a 91 wide board...but I never used a 8.4m sail on such wide board. I will try my Carpenter 47 cm fin with 9m sail.

In my experience the weight of a board makes a big difference in the feeling you get. A lighter board feels more vivid/lively and gets on the plane easier. A heavier board feels sluggish when compared directly to a lighter version.

I had a Fanatic falcon 152 slalom board that was the predecessor of the falcon lightwind 159. The falcon 152 had the same length and width but it was about 1 kg lighter because of the full carbon construction whereas the falcon lightwind 159 is a glass fibre construction. I had the falcon lightwind 159 from 2019 in grey.

Using the same fins the carbon Falcon 152 was loose and vivid and fast. When you hit a gust, the acceleration was instantaneous without hesitation. In the same conditions the Falcon Lightwind 159 with 1 kg higher weight was never loose and felt really slow compared to the lighter Falcon 152. I never got it high on the water and nicely loose like I did with the lighter Falcon 152.

Was it only the weight? I'm not sure but it makes a lot of difference in my opinion. After this experience I bought a Patrik Formula 180 Airinside and this board feels lighter than the Fanatic Falcon lightwind 159 even though it is 10 cm wider. After that I was convinced about the importance of board weight and now I have a Patrik slalom 115 Airinside, a slalom 140 Airinside and I just bought a Patrik hybrid 91 Airinside hoping it will get me some more nice light wind days with 9 and 10m sails.

Hello!

I recently bought a Patrik Hybrid 91 Airinside and I want to use it with a fin for light wind slalom/formula cruising. Anyone here who has this board and knows which fin sizes work well under it? I thought about rebasing some old formula fins to use under the board.

Hello, I'm new here and saw this question that I had myself some time ago. It came from the idea of rebasing a longer fin to a smaller size. I was looking for some Carpenter fins because I had bought two of them which gave me the best response I ever had with a fin. Formula, thèse fins have the best balance between power/lift and control, BUT I haven't tried every brand yet off course.

In my search for second hand fins I saw that the most fin sizes I could find were the longer ones like 45 to 47 cm fins. The reason is that a lot of people changed to foiling in light wind and so they sold their light wind slalom fins. One of the guys I bought two Carpenter fins from pavement the contact info for the fin builder and I sent him an email to ask whether shortening his fins would make a different fin. He told me all his fins are the same with regard to layup so a 47cm fin could be cut and rebased to 32 cm without a problem.

In the meantime I already cut a 45 cm to 42 cm, a 38 to 36cm, a 47 to 43 cm and another 47 cm to 40 cm and they all are really good fins with the same characteristics as the original Carpenter fins that haven't been cut. I have a 37, 38, 44, 46 and 47 cm in original condition. You really can't tell the difference with a cut one.

I have been testing more brands and had a conversation with the man behind Nolo fins and Sonntag and they told me rebasing their fins to a shooter length would make a difference with an original. Both told me the layup they use change in other sizes but rebasing is certainly possible if it is for only 2 to 4 cm max.

My first test rebasing a fin to a smaller size was cutting an older 70 cm carbon formula fin to 57 cm for a Fanatic Falcon 152 from 2013. That fin was really nice in light wind conditions!

If you want to cut a fin yo a shorter size, I would say you just try it. It will probably work alright.

I hope this Helps you out...